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Author Topic: Maltodextrin  (Read 358 times)

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Offline MomRosie

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Maltodextrin
« on: June 10, 2018, 09:47:34 PM »
Hi friends-

I just can't seem to find a post listing the amounts (literally I need the measurement amounts) of maltodextrin to use as a stabilizer/reducing agent when making colloidal silver over 40ppm.

And at what ppm is it not strong enough to be a stabilizer and gelatin needs to be used?

And if I'm using it to stabilize and reduce, do I double the amount?

If my understanding is flawed please tell me where I need to read to learn.

Thank you

Offline cfnisbet

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #1 on: June 11, 2018, 05:20:32 AM »
Kephra will no doubt give more accurate figures, but I can help you with the amounts that I use.

I would first suggest that anything over 80ppm would really benefit from the use of gelatine as a capping agent.

If you increase the amount of Distilled Water, you need to increase the amount of Maltodextrin, but use the same amount of electrolyte. I use 1 ml of 0.1M Maltodextrin in 3 litres of DW, with the intention of making 20 ppm colloidal silver. This is not much, but it reduces the ISO beautifully and the end result is crystal clear. I find that Maltodextrin is far better than Glucose or Fructose, which both tend to result in some level of turbidity.

To make a 0.1 Molar solution of Maltodextrin, dissolve 5.05 grams of Maltodextrin powder in 100ml of distilled water. It dissolves very easily. The amount of reducing agent is not critical, so you could use a few drops of this 0.1 molar solution in a litre. Below this amount of Distilled Water (ie if you are only making 250 mls of colloidal silver) then the same few drops would be fine.

Offline Cher Sherwood

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #2 on: June 11, 2018, 10:11:36 AM »
I've been wondering, if anything over 80ppm is better off gelatine capped, why not just always use gelatine, even for under 80ppm? I'm glad this came up today as I keep meaning to ask.
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Offline kephra

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #3 on: June 11, 2018, 10:23:57 AM »
Even if you gelatin cap, you still have to use karo or maltodextrin, since gelatin is not a good reducing agent.  Gelatin is only a (very good) stabilizer.
Colloidal Silver is only a bargain if you make it yourself.

Offline cfnisbet

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #4 on: June 11, 2018, 11:44:09 AM »
I've been wondering, if anything over 80ppm is better off gelatine capped, why not just always use gelatine, even for under 80ppm? I'm glad this came up today as I keep meaning to ask.
It would be nice if there was "one item to rule them all" but there is an additional reason to not use gelatine for the lower ppm batches. It has not yet been established (yet) that gelatine-capped colloidal silver is useful for external purposes. The gelatine-capped colloidal silver is designed for internal use, and is excellent for that. There is a lot of discussion about which version is best for external use, but the same gelatine that keeps the colloidal silver from being destroyed internally by stomach acid, is the same chemical which may stop or reduce the effectiveness of colloidal silver on external injuries.

I use any version except gelatine-capped colloidal silver for external use, and cinnamon-capped or gelatine-capped internally, with a preference for the gelatine by a long way. The strength of the colloidal silver is a completely separate issue. 20ppm is a great combination of effectiveness and stability. I suppose this does not exactly answer your question but there is nothing to digest the gelatine off from the colloidal silver particles in an external injury.

Offline Dean

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #5 on: June 12, 2018, 09:21:07 AM »
Hi friends-

I just can't seem to find a post listing the amounts (literally I need the measurement amounts) of maltodextrin to use as a stabilizer/reducing agent when making colloidal silver over 40ppm.

And at what ppm is it not strong enough to be a stabilizer and gelatin needs to be used?

And if I'm using it to stabilize and reduce, do I double the amount?

If my understanding is flawed please tell me where I need to read to learn.

Thank you

Hi MomRosie,

I'm not sure if this helps you or answers your question directly. I have put this up before but it's a calculator I created
to work stuff out for myself and it kind of grew and grew.
Wayne has version that is not Microsoft so if you don't have or use excel, and run this, it may not present or function as it
does if it's opened and used in MS Excel. but its here for anyone that wants it.

As threads tend to get buried quite quickly here I tend to "bump" it's existence for new users or forum members who may not be
aware of it that's all.

If you have any difficulty let me know. I could possibly mail it to you somehow.
But have a look and see if helps.

I can't even recall if it's totally finished so take the blood volume thing with a pinch of salt. It's still a bit of a work in progress.


Its natively a Excel 2010 workbook. and is my Silver Assistant!


https://www.dropbox.com/s/43jnmzh32o4k8ss/Calculator%20V2.01.xlsx?dl=0

Offline MomRosie

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #6 on: June 12, 2018, 06:52:34 PM »

Thank you Dean, I appreciate the link.

 Unfortunately, I can't change any of the field boxes.

Offline Cher Sherwood

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #7 on: June 13, 2018, 11:11:35 AM »
Hey Dean, it must be because I am on a Mac, but I can't change any of the drop down boxes to see what the actual amounts of maltodextrin to help MomRosie out with definitive amounts to put in as a reducer for different volumes of water.

Neat idea with the chart though!

The only thing you can control in life is your reaction.

Offline Bobby

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #8 on: June 13, 2018, 12:08:45 PM »
Rosi and Cher,

  Download EXCEL from the Apple App Store.  When you hit the link Dean gave tell it to open in Excel and your good to go.

Bobby
"Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power"  Abraham Lincoln

Offline Argentum

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2018, 10:22:25 PM »
Got my hands on some maltodextrin. I must say that it produces a very clear (non-turbid) and a slightly lighter shade of colloidal silver (40 PPM, gelatine capped). Before this I was using Karo light corn syrup (w/fructose added), and always had a hint of turbidity.

A question: is the reducing agent a catalyst, or does it gets used up in the reduction? From my reading here it appears that it gets used up.

The reason I ask is that in this thread the recommended amount of maltodextrin to use varies greatly. From 0.017 grams per liter (cfnisbet) to  0.5 grams per liter (Dean).

I used the 1/2 gram per liter in the batches, just to be sure it reduced OK. But it seems to impart a strange taste to the colloidal silver. Thanks.

Argentum

Offline emanwols

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #10 on: July 13, 2018, 04:18:10 AM »
Got my hands on some maltodextrin. I must say that it produces a very clear (non-turbid) and a slightly lighter shade of colloidal silver (40 PPM, gelatine capped). Before this I was using Karo light corn syrup (w/fructose added), and always had a hint of turbidity.

A question: is the reducing agent a catalyst, or does it gets used up in the reduction? From my reading here it appears that it gets used up.

The reason I ask is that in this thread the recommended amount of maltodextrin to use varies greatly. From 0.017 grams per liter (cfnisbet) to  0.5 grams per liter (Dean).

I used the 1/2 gram per liter in the batches, just to be sure it reduced OK. But it seems to impart a strange taste to the colloidal silver. Thanks.

Argentum
https://www.cgcsforum.com/index.php?topic=3713.0
This shows that too much reducing agent has no detrimental effect
I use 1tsp per 5400ml batch i produce to 40ppm

Offline kephra

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #11 on: July 13, 2018, 06:20:35 AM »
Quote
A question: is the reducing agent a catalyst, or does it gets used up in the reduction? From my reading here it appears that it gets used up.
It gets used up, in that the maltodextrin loses its reducing power by being oxidized by the silver.  For one thing to be reduced, something else must be oxidized.
Colloidal Silver is only a bargain if you make it yourself.

Offline Argentum

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2018, 12:31:37 PM »
https://www.cgcsforum.com/index.php?topic=3713.0
This shows that too much reducing agent has no detrimental effect
I use 1tsp per 5400ml batch i produce to 40ppm

That would be about 0.57 grams per liter. I weighed 1 tsp at 3.1 grams, +- 0.1 g. Which is in line with what Dean recommends.

Using too much may not be detrimental to reducing the CD. But using 0.5 gram per liter does impart a strange flavor to it.

Used Karo in the past and the colloidal silver tasted like nothing. Just the way distilled water with agNP should taste.

I'm running a batch now, going to use about 0.1 grams of maltodextrin.

Argentum

Offline Argentum

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2018, 12:34:58 PM »
Quote
A question: is the reducing agent a catalyst, or does it gets used up in the reduction? From my reading here it appears that it gets used up.
It gets used up, in that the maltodextrin loses its reducing power by being oxidized by the silver.  For one thing to be reduced, something else must be oxidized.

That is what I thought, thank you for verifying.

Argentum

Offline Argentum

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Re: Maltodextrin
« Reply #14 on: July 18, 2018, 07:38:24 AM »
So... using the approximately 0.1 gram of maltodextrin per liter works. Ended up as the same color as when using 0.5 grams. But with a much lower strange taste to it, barely noticeable.

Argentum