Author Topic: 320ppm Capped  (Read 3063 times)

Aquariusbutafly

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320ppm Capped
« on: April 01, 2017, 09:50:16 PM »
I'm very excited my magnetic stirrer/hot plate is on the way. I have read through the quick start guide (https://www.cgcsforum.org/index.php?topic=758.0) but am looking for a more detailed guide. Perhaps I am not searching well enough. If someone already has a link to the post I'd really appreciate you sharing. Thanks!

Aquariusbutafly

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2017, 10:12:33 PM »
Questions after reading quick start guide:

1.When do I add gelatin? When do I reduce?

2. Temperature set at 160 degrees F?


Offline kephra

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2017, 10:28:25 PM »
Start with room temperature water.
Add the gelatin
Turn on the stirrer.
Add the sodium carbonate and Karo syrup.
Turn on the heater.
When the temperature is above 160 start the run.
Start with a small batch, like 250ml until you are confident in the procedure.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

Aquariusbutafly

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2017, 11:38:59 PM »
Thank you!

Offline Art

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2017, 05:04:18 AM »
I've taken to microwaving after adding the gelatin in order to get the water hot faster than the heater can raise the water temperature........about a minute and a half depending on the power of your microwave. This shortens total production time and probably slightly lessens wear on the heater. The gelatin looks completely dissolved when it comes out of the microwave.

Art

Offline Neofizz

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2017, 06:33:57 PM »
I start with a liter of water in my beaker, add the electrolyte, then pour half of it in another container and into the microwave till it's almost boiling. While that's happening, I'm adding the gelatin to the cold half and letting it bloom, with constant stirring. When the microwave is done I take that hot water and pour it straight into the cold (using borosilicate beaker) while it's still mixing. Almost instantly all the gelatin is dissolved. I add the light corn syrup and start the run.

I would do as Art but I can't fit the one liter into my microwave.
"Be kinder than necessary, for everyone you meet is fighting some kind of battle."

Offline Dean

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2017, 10:36:17 PM »
Questions after reading quick start guide:

1.When do I add gelatin? When do I reduce?

2. Temperature set at 160 degrees F?

Aq,

What PPM are you looking to make?
Is this a follow on request from your last post?
If it's 320ppm you should be able to use the guide I put up for you.
It was a step by step for the whole process. I hope it helps you.


Offline Bobby

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2017, 04:27:53 PM »
Kephra,

  I got a question that I don't remember seeing ask anywhere on the forum.

  When we make 320ppm colloidal silver and add all the ingredients in at the start, what keeps the gelatin from capping the Karo or the EL before the AgNP? 

  Thanks, Bobby
"Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power"  Abraham Lincoln

Offline kephra

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2017, 07:00:48 PM »
Molecules cannot 'cap' other molecules.  They are too small and there is no substantial attraction between them.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

Offline Bobby

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2017, 03:28:16 AM »
Kephra,

  Ok well that makes sense even for a chemistry challenged guy like me.  Thanks,

Bobby
"Nearly all men can stand adversity, but if you want to test a man's character, give him power"  Abraham Lincoln

Aquariusbutafly

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2017, 05:14:31 AM »
Questions after reading quick start guide:

1.When do I add gelatin? When do I reduce?

2. Temperature set at 160 degrees F?

Aq,

What PPM are you looking to make?
Is this a follow on request from your last post?
If it's 320ppm you should be able to use the guide I put up for you.
It was a step by step for the whole process. I hope it helps you.



Thanks Dean your guide is very helpful. I'm trying to make 320ppm. This is a follow up for the last post.I like to have many sources on a topic/approaches.  :D

Aquariusbutafly

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2017, 11:51:47 PM »
Another question, why does there have to be constant heat for 320ppm? Why can't heat be added afterward like with 20ppm?

Offline kephra

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2017, 12:10:46 AM »
Another question, why does there have to be constant heat for 320ppm? Why can't heat be added afterward like with 20ppm?

Two reasons:
The gelatin must be kept hot the entire time so that the silver is capped as it is made.
The heat speeds the chemical reduction reactions so the released silver ions stays below the solubility limit.
There is the unknown and the unknowable.  It's a wise man who knows the difference.

Offline Dean

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #13 on: April 07, 2017, 12:11:16 AM »
Another question, why does there have to be constant heat for 320ppm? Why can't heat be added afterward like with 20ppm?

Silver has a solubility limit. At room temp, it's about 20ppm. If you keep generating silver oxide at the same temperature the water basically says, enough is enough, won't hold any more  and the excess will just precipitate out and ruin your batch.

You can raise this limit by heating the water. I believe you can get it up to about 40ppm as a maximum with just heat alone. But at higher ppm you need to get the silver oxide reduced to nanoparticles more quickly than the silver oxide is being produced by your electrolysis.

Think of it as bailing out a boat with a hole in it. All the time you keep the water "empty" enough of silver oxide, you've got room to add more. The constant heat keeps the solubility limit higher and because you've already added the reducing agent, as soon as it makes contact with the newly present silver oxide, it turns it straight to silver particles, freeing up space in the cell for more silver oxide !

Ha! We overlapped (scratch that, you plain beat me to it Kephra!)


As Kephra says though, Your gelatine, needs to be properly dissolved and the heat ensures this is the case the whole time

Simples !!
« Last Edit: April 07, 2017, 12:17:12 AM by Dean »

Aquariusbutafly

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Re: 320ppm Capped
« Reply #14 on: April 07, 2017, 12:17:03 AM »
Thanks!!