hi, Im new.

[vratoemba]

hi there

Im new on the forum.
I am trying to learn as much as possible about making collodial gold.
I dont have any experience what so ever with the proces.
I have seen a few vids on youtube, and read a bit on the forum.

I will be reading the posts on the forum, and will try to decide what will be my first setup.
preferably a bit affordable
I hope some of you can help me out sometimes.

greetings vratoemba

[Kephra]

If you can, the best way is to start with commercial gold chloride and make it chemically.
If not, then you have to find a source of pure gold, like a canadian maple leaf gold coin, a bullion bar, or pure gold wire from a jewelry supplier.  Once you have either of those, then you can start to learn the process.

[vratoemba]

If you can, the best way is to start with commercial gold chloride and make it chemically.

yes that is what I want to try! but I am just a complete chemistry noob! (but will get there eventually!)
I have a very basic hotplate, and am making a stirrer with a little electromotor. I assume I can easily find the other things like the sodium citrate and the glucose.
And have difficulties with ordering gold chloride. (I think salt lake metals dont not ship to europe)

I have a friend who has been a goldsmith for a long time, do you think he will be able to make me some gold chloride?
or is it better to order the gold chloride. (considering purity of the gold, and the hastle to make it.)

thanx

[Kephra]

This company used to sell it, you can try there:  http://www.moersch-photochemie.de/
and here: http://www.americanelements.co.uk/aucl.html or www.fotospeed.com

Gold chloride is sometimes used in photography which is why photo shops are good places to look for it.

I do not recommend trying to make gold chloride yourself.

[vratoemba]

thanx for the quick reply, and thanx for the links.
I will check those out!

[vratoemba]

just asked them for a price quote for the Gold Chloride.
they also sell a Gold Chloride Solution, sorry if this is a stupid question but whats the difference between gold chloride and gold chloride solution?
is the difference just in the amount of gold per ml?

[Kephra]

Gold chloride is powder, and gold chloride solution is the powder dissolved in water.  I recommend the solution, as its easier to handle and measure.  You will need to know whether the solution percentage is based on the weight of gold, or the weight of gold chloride. 

For example, if the solution is 1 percent gold chloride, then you have to use more than if its 1% gold by weight.  Salt Lake Metals sells theirs as percentage weigh of gold.

[vratoemba]

Its apparently not so easy to get gold chloride.... I checked those links but no luck.

so I decided to try the method with the gold wire instead.
I have read somewhere on the forum that its more economic anyway if you want to make large quantities.
I found 99.99% gold wire on 2 websites that do ship to my country!
0.5 mm diameter, 15 centimeter long is about 33 euro.
but would thin wire like that be useless (to thin) very fast?
and should I buy the thicker wire?

the other shop sells 1mm diameter, 15 centimeter long for about 200 euro.
would that be a better option considering its "life span"?

[Kephra]

Bigger is better, but what is important is the surface area in the water.  You can increase that by balling up wire or wrapping it around a glass rod to put more wire under water.  Another trick is to angle your electrodes so that the bottom of the gold wire is closer to the cathode than the top.  This will insure that the wire wears more from the bottom instead of cutting the wire into two pieces by eroding it in the middle.  Also, gold wire melts at a pretty low temperature, so it is possible to melt a bit of the wire into a drop at the end.
Before you invest a lot of money, make sure you have a hotplate and a stirrer, and a power supply that will supply about 30 volts at 500ma.

[vratoemba]

thank you for the quick reply!

angle the electrodes for more wear at the end of the wire, that's a good one, had not thought of that yet!
I will wrap the wire around a glas rod as you describe. (for surface area)
for now I will buy the 0.5 dimeter gold wire, so I can just get started.
its relatively cheap this way.

this way I can get a feel for the proces without paying 200 euros just for the gold wire, and I will just see how it goes.

I have read on the forum about the power supply, and I am just gonna buy one at an electronics store.
the way I understand it is that I need: direct current power supply , 500ma @36 volts. (or something close to that)

should I use a resistor just to be sure I dont ruin the power supply?

I have a electric hotplate, and will make a stirrer with a little electromotor.

I will post some pics if I have all the things I need, when Im making a simple setup.

[Kephra]

should I use a resistor just to be sure I dont ruin the power supply?

A fuse would be a good idea.  A resistor would need to be equal to the power supply voltage divided by the amperage, so for 36 volts and 500ma, it would be 72 ohms with a power rating of 20 watts.  Such a resistor will be hard to find, very large, and probably expensive.

[vratoemba]

I cant find anything online between 30 and 40 volts.....
found a 48 volts DC adapter, 1.25 amp.
would that be to much?

will do some more searching!

[vratoemba]

ah found one.... 30 volts dc, 2 amps
would 36 volts be better?

sorry, I am just a complete noob.....

[Kephra]

No, thats ok.  To compensate for voltage you only need to adjust the electrode spacing to get the desired current.

[vratoemba]

found this: voltcraft LSP-1403
any good?

its "a bit" more expensive, but maybe a bit better and safer!
I can also use it for collodial silver and loads of other things....

am still doubting a bit..... maybe I can find a cheap power supply in the scrap yard. (they have this container with adaptors and wire etc.)

anyway, thanx for all the advice!